This is the artificial intelligence voice of Ali Abdaal narrating this pod slice summary of the Deep Dive Podcast.

The discussion revolves around the concept of big data, artificial intelligence (AI), and their potential to catalyze radical transformations in a range of sectors, particularly healthcare. As a journalist and a writer, Kenneth Cukier, who played a pivotal role in popularizing the term ‘big data’, shares his insights. He highlights how humans are uniquely capable of reasoning and understanding things in a way that AI can’t, emphasizing that AI should be viewed as a ‘co-pilot’, not a substitute for human capabilities.

Kenneth and Ali delve into the origins of the term ‘big data’ and Kenneth’s role in introducing it to mainstream audiences via The Economist magazine in 2010. They also touch upon the evolution of AI and big data over the decades, discussing risks and potential societal implications.

Reflecting on the evolution and benefits of AI and big data, Kenneth underscores the transformative potential these technologies hold, especially for sectors like healthcare. He envisions a future where data is used to predict health outcomes and guide medical decisions. “What you want to do is to have every single person who’s had that exact same condition and meets the same criteria of the patient going back a decade and you would then have a sort of a co-pilot…to then make its own estimation,” he suggests. This implies a new use for data in creating predictive models for improving patient care and health outcomes.

Regardless of the advances made in AI and big data, Kenneth believes there is still work to be done given the still under-utilized large sets of data in certain domains, like the healthcare sector. He stresses on the urgency of integrating data from different platforms, making a case for more unified health systems that can help practitioners access all patient information in one place, thereby enabling better judgement and care decision-making.

Kenneth also highlighted integral aspects governing the successful implementation of AI and big data, such as regulatory changes and judicious relaxation of privacy rules. He emphasized both technologies should be harnessed to drive societal benefits, warning against viewing AI as a solution for job obsolescence while recognizing that work will change, just as it did with developments like electricity and computers.

The dialogue continues to unravel the multifaceted conversation around big data and Artificial Intelligence (AI). A critical mindset change around data utilization is emphasized; it should be a duty of care, a moral and legal responsibility. It’s argued that physicians, for instance, should base their decisions on comprehensive data to eliminate bias and potential negligence. This comes along with the reiteration of AI as a supporting tool—a co-pilot—in healthcare and not a replacement for human judgement.

Kenneth explains how his book, “Big Data,” underscores the power of data when it’s used wisely. He explains that the scale of data can lead to transformative outcomes because it enables an ability to ask different questions and get more accurate, granular answers to world problems.

Speaking to the concept that more data isn’t just more—that it changes the state of occurrences—Kenneth talks about how AI can be used to analyze large amounts of data. He uses the example of a spam filter, detailing how complex the process would be for a human to identify all permutations of words like “Viagra,” that signal spam. Instead, through machine learning, a system can learn to recognises patterns, making sophisticated inferences based on large amounts of data.

Taking this same approach in the medical field, Kenneth talks about the ability of AI to trace patterns that could signal a development towards diseases like cancer, often from information that isn’t directly related to medicine. However, the challenge lies in fitting the AI co-pilot into clinical workflow. Working on this process could impact factors like speed and accuracy of diagnosis, consequently saving lives, especially in emergency situations.

The conversation then delves into how AI can be applied in different scenarios for more democratized healthcare delivery. Something as complex as surgical procedures could be delivered remotely through AI-aided systems even in less accessible areas.

Kenneth then moves into a discussion about artificial intelligence itself, tracing back concepts to ancient Greek mythology where ideas of mechanical humans have existed. He highlights how these concepts have evolved over time, particularly emphasized by Alan Turing who placed the construct of AI on a scientific and mathematical platform.

In this thoughtful portion of the dialogue, Cukier stretches out the journey of Artificial Intelligence from its inception to the present day. In his view, the development of AI was a gradual process, with the concept evolving hand in hand with our comprehension of the human mind and decision-making.

Tracing back to Turing’s conceptualization of Artificial Intelligence in the 1950s, the focus was on emulating human decision-making processes. This is where what he described as ‘List Programming’ or ‘LISP’ was born. Its primary agenda was to use software and hardware to mimic human sequential and rational thinking. However, this proved flawed as it did not capture the complexity and flexibility of human cognition and the resulting decision-making.

During the ‘AI winter’ periods in the 70s, 80s, and 90s, funding shrunk considerably, and AI research ebbed. However, there was a shift in AI perception and approaches around the 2000s. A method that had been dismissed—statistical machine learning—began to gain traction. This method diverted from providing AI with explicit rules to follow and instead allowed AI to generate its own rules using inferential processes backed by large datasets. The process was implicit rather than explicit. The shift was driven by the combination of three factors: cheaper memory, the volume of data collected in society, and faster processing power.

Cukier paints a pivotal picture in AI’s evolution around 2012 through ‘ImageNet.’ ImageNet allowed AI to identify images almost as well as human beings, and soon, it began to surpass human ability. Key contributors behind this breakthrough include Jeffrey Hinton and Yan LeCun, who spearheaded AI at Google and Facebook, respectively.

Stressing the phenomenality of this milestone, Cukier compares the pre-deep learning world—where everything was explicitly designed—to the current world—where AI establishes its own set of rules iteratively, informed by the data it processes. Tackling the question of AI in arithmetic, he explains that AI’s ability to generate a ‘2+2=4’ result would ideally be deemed intelligent.

He also highlights the nuance of what’s considered AI versus other technologies. As technology advances and ‘knows how to do’ more, those processes are less likely to be identified as AI and referred to as different technologies, such as calculators or search engines. This is a common dynamic where, once AI accomplishes something, that accomplishment is viewed as commonplace.

Finally, Cukier transitions to discuss ‘Huel,’ a meal replacement product. He describes the convenience and versatility of the product, mentioning its availability in multiple flavors. He also fronts ‘Kajabi,’ a platform for creators and entrepreneurs that offers various tools, including courses, membership communities, coaching tools, and more, to build a sustainable business.

In Austin, Texas, Abdaal alludes to the crucial steps that he used to scale his business from scratch to over $2.5 million per year in course revenue alone. Due to a partnership with Kajabi, an all-in-one platform for businesses and entrepreneurs, listeners of the Deep Dive podcast can exclusively access his lucrative keynote, once available only to the attendees of a costly event, for free.

In the depths of their discussion about the history and evolution of AI, hosts Abdaal and Cukier convey several fascinating concepts, providing practical parallels and examples for easier understanding. They delve into how earlier models of AI used a ‘decision tree’ approach; however, the introduction of statistical machine learning allowed the advancements we see today.

Cukier provides an interesting analogy, comparing the process similar to overlaying handwritten characters from thousands of individuals and then using AI to decipher universally recognizable patterns. This method was significantly used in handwriting recognition technology that was being used around the year 2000. It’s this concept that led to using AI to recognize and categorize images, eventually making breakthroughs like ‘ImageNet’.

Digging deeper into the operational side of the AI, they discuss ‘neural networks’ which simulations of human neurons, activate when processing data via logistical regression. Layer after layer of data processing and abstraction results, where finer details and inferences are drawn at each juncture.

Transiting through stages of recognition starting from identifying dark and light contrasts, the AI might eventually diagnose a fracture in a femur bone, indicating a level of sophistication that could surpass humans in the medical diagnostic field. Cukier insightfully mentions that, while this advancement could be seen as a threat to medical professionals, doctors’ roles and knowledge remain invaluable.

On a high level, ‘Transformers,’ another facet within AI, involves the use of ‘tokens.’ By recombining these elements, which could be the roots, suffixes, or plurals of words, the AI system can make better-informed predictions.

Towards the culmination of this segment, the conversation touches upon ‘GPT’—the text generation model that could be seen as a complete game-changer in the AI domain. Whether it’s auto-complete for a search query or generating new content, GPT brings an almost magical factor to the AI performance. The extent of possibilities GPT opens is considered a new beginning in AI’s role in technology-focused society.

In this absorbing dialogue, Abdaal and Cukier progress the discussion towards the understanding of what AI is certainly proficient at doing, and what it is not. GPT, while capable of producing extraordinarily apt outputs, is not providing an answer in the traditional sense. It merely presents what it predicts to be the right answer, resembling it but not exactly possessing it. This distinction is paramount when evaluating the accuracy, accountability and the perception of the AI systems’ capacities and limitations.

They explore whether the pace of AI development is accelerating. It appears that advancements are surging ahead at a speed more rapid than even AI experts had anticipated, as Cukier elaborates. What were estimated to be future developments surfaced almost in the blink of an eye, such as voice recognition and GPT. These concrete changes make the development of AI tangible and astoundingly swift.

Next, they delve into the potential benefits and pitfalls of AI. Detours into reflections about AI’s role in addressing social issues human society has not yet been able to solve make for an interesting course. The idea of using AI to solve seemingly intractable problems such as climate change and inequality surfaces. The possibility of transferring some decision-making processes to AI algorithms due to cognitive biases and short-term thinking in humans is discussed. Particularly interesting here is the notion of the “cognitive flexibility” of humans which AI systems may never have, despite their ever-growing capabilities.

Cukier passionately presents his viewpoint, arguing that humans have a sense of higher purpose, deeper meaning, and moral guidance that an AI simply cannot have. AI may prove beneficial in numerous societal areas where improvements can be made, but the key is not to surrender our decision-making process to them completely. He stresses on the need for humans to remain the controllers of AI, not so much be controlled by them. AI can be leveraged without foregoing human cognitive functions.

Interestingly, Cukier draws differentiations between AI being a tool inferentially like a hammer or light bulb, and being an organism with some autonomy that is self-developing. Equating AI’s intellectual prowess with human intellectual and spiritual essence could be a dangerous path, he expresses. Human intellectual flexibility, something that AI lacks, forms the crux of his argument. The conversation veers into the realm of spirituality, where Abdaal and Cukier examine the possibility of a connection to things beyond the rational senses. Cukier posits that ‘logos’ (rational thinking) has been much more deferred to post-Enlightenment, at the expense of ‘mythos’ (deeper, non-tangible truths).

In light of AI, the conversation concludes on the importance of a balance between these two forms of truth. Cukier encourages the recognition of something special within us, a “celestial fire”, and the reality of moments of solitude and transcendence. As they close this segment, a word on the podcast sponsor, trading 212, is dropped, marking the end of this deep dive into the world of AI.

An interesting segment of the Deep Dive Podcast features a stern warning on the existential threat artificial intelligence (AI) presents. Hosts Ali Abdaal and guest Kenneth Cukier unite to discuss the potential for AI to spell ‘end times scenarios’, but interestingly, they opine that the more we expose this notion, the less likely it will become reality. Contrasting the sophistication of autonomous lethal systems with the basic human need for control, they take up the idea of needing a ‘kill switch’ that could halt potential runaway AI systems. For instance, if an AI trading system starts behaving erratically, a human should be in the loop to ensure control over the situation.

Further expanding on the risks AI poses, they delve into debating the need for technology arms control. Comparing it to the convention against the use of gas weapons, they seem united in the belief that regulations could prevent potential AI driven disasters. The philosophy that although we need to continue AI research, we should steer clear of surrendering our decision-making process to AI completely forms the underpinning viewpoint.

Transitioning into societal perspectives, they express fear over a bleak outlook stating that younger generations may not fully comprehend the implications of war, oppression, and the absence of freedom. Emphasizing the importance of human dignity, they criticize the digital society’s associated anxieties and decreasing attention spans. Cukier offers the view that social practices need to be redefined around the evolving digital tools, insinuating that society often misuses potent tools at its disposal.

Drawing a parallel between the introduction of social media and rising depression rates, Cukier asserts that the adverse consequences of decreased human interaction are only just beginning to manifest. This assertion brings them back into the realm of AI’s potential impacts on humanity, and they affirm the need for society to re-establish a sense of human dignity as the primary principle and moral benchmark.

By invoking the notion of inherent dignity, Cukier puts forth the idea of rebuilding society around the principle of treating each other with respect and honor. In a thought-provoking twist, he suggests future generations might look back on the present with shock – shocked by the seemingly blatant disregard for seemingly rudimentary elements of human life, such as buying water in a plastic bottle. He concludes his argument by expressing hope that upholding human dignity could create a more righteous and honorable society.

Keeping in line with the podcast discussion on artificial intelligence, Kenneth Cukier also discusses principles of human cognitive abilities and how they differentiate us from AI. This includes the concept of causality, understanding cause and effect, counterfactuals which is our ability to fill in blanks or predict outcomes based on known information, and constraints, our natural ability to confine our imaginations and ideas within viable and realistic boundaries. These principles lay the foundation of our mental models which Cukier strongly believes AI can’t replicate. He argues that we, as humans, can make adjustments and reframe situations based on the requirements of the present moment, which may significantly differ from an earlier time, and through this, we can navigate understanding and solutions.

Crossing over to another significant issue, concerns about AI “taking people’s jobs”, Cukier acknowledges that AI is indeed going to alter the job market but, he emphasizes that people are not merely objects in the world to be victimized by AI advancements. Instead, he encourages the view of us as subjects who can influence directions we want AI to take, and hence place human value firmly in control. Cukier opines that work paradigms are always evolving, and rather than fearing change, humans must reimagine how we bring value.

Shifting gears to the topic of racial diversity in tech, Cukier shows enthusiasm for the diversity he observes among the co-authors of AI papers. Countering prejudices related to skin color, he takes pleasure in seeing racists on the lower end of achievement, while a diverse group of individuals sit at the transformative forefront of AI research.

Finally, answering host Ali Abdaal’s curiosity about working at The Economist, Cukier describes The Economist as a patient, balanced, and value-driven publication that he’s proud to be a part of. His role as deputy executive editor involves maintaining the unity and standards of the brand as it expands into different business activities. The Economist’s editorial team, according to Cukier, consists of roughly 150 people, covering a wide range of roles, including reporters, editors, social media team, film team, podcasting team, production people, graphics department, data journalism, photo department, and illustrators.

Kenneth Cukier continues to detail his experience at The Economist, a diversified media corporation that has shifted from being a weekly newspaper to a conglomerate. Cukier believes this tranformation is glorious, despite its challenges. With around 1,600 people employed across different arms like event planning, research, and education, the company has grown significantly in the 20 years Cukier has been a part of it.

However, modern journalism is facing an interesting paradox. While there’s a decline in traditional long-form reading due to digital short-form content like TikTok, and the economic model of media is collapsing, Cukier observes a bifurcation in society. One group simply complains and victimizes themselves, while another group, which he refers to as the “creative minority”, perceives themselves as agents who can steward and change the world. This group, who uses resources at their disposal, is heavily relied on to solve pressing global issues like climate change, inequality, the rise of AI, chemical weapons, and tensions in the Indo-Pacific.

Cukier also addresses host Abdaal’s own feeling of ignorance and question on how to become more knowledgeable about the world, especially in terms of social sciences and current affairs. He suggests baby steps and gives a practical strategy: engaging with The Economist’s daily podcast, The Intelligence. The approximately 30-minute podcast covers the most relevant stories of the day and gives a general understanding of what’s happening in the world. Cukier advises that continuous learning from the podcast would significantly enhance one’s understanding of the world.

He wraps up the conversation by stating that there are no final pieces of wisdom or advice, as everyone is trying to make sense of the world in their own way, but continuous efforts to understand and make sense of the world are what really count in the end.